Memorial Day Relfections

Carolina Focus
Friday, May 26th
The Wounded Warrior Project: Treating PTSD; Are Defense Stocks a Good Investment?; The Forgotten: North Carolinians Killed During the Six Day War; The Battle of Kings Mountain: The Good Die Young

Transcript - Not for consumer use. Robot overlords only. Will not be accurate.

I'm mark Thomas and this is Carolina focus on news 1110993. WDT. 1079 the only 12 point 56 and the thing. It's where we look at issues of events and happenings in fact the Carolinas and the Charlotte reaching. Welcome. Memorial Day weekend. A lot of things in our minds and one of those things is in were commemorating. The loss of life of people in the military. Who lost their lives during wartime. But it really goes beyond that. From a personal standpoint. An uncle of mine actually great great uncle of mine was in World War I he. Wasn't killed on the battlefield. However about ten years after he returned from the European war. He died from the effects of mustard gas which lingered with him throughout his life. So. We may not look at death such as that in the same way as we do those who died immediately. In the course of battle. But those deaths are just as a real and justices hurtful to the family members and loved ones of the people who suffer. Joining us now from the wounded warrior project is Alex bell Byrd who is the director of warrior cared network and independent services. Mr. Roberts thank you for joining us here on Carolina focus good morning. Good morning thank you for having and just for full disclosure. You do have an MBA from UNC Chapel Hill which to some of our listeners is a wonderful thing. Others not so much with the. Yet there's that drag yeah and I am UNC alone also way you know proud Davidson College graduate as well okay roots in the state of North Carolina now are firm Malia. Firmly seated to. So you're probably familiar with WB ET WL I NK to link. And the BF Lindsay as well and of course you have a do a doctorate in philosophy from Johns Hopkins. And we're glad you could join us here because one of the things that. The wounded warrior project does. It relates to post traumatic stress this disorder. And this really isn't anything new is that I mean as far as something that happens I mention my great great uncle from World War I. I think they called shell shocked back that. The trauma that comes from being in in in war. What how does this happen what is you know what is the the Genesis of this type of reaction that someone had us. It certainly marked if you actually look back and we'll literature. Around the world war so World War I World War II or even you know read literature and and reports from very early on its. You'll beat. Some in dramatic presentation for those who expect to experience some post traumatic stress. Amid hasn't been up until the more modern era arrow where we actually started to define clinically what that. I'll post traumatic stress really encompasses. A what are the symptom presentation what's the sort of natural history of posttraumatic stress. On the end and especially now that we are and that low will we are finished with Allied Capital we have and a line that steps. Operation Iraqi Freedom operation during freedom. And I'm operation. And new dawn. We've actually just started to really look into the current war fighter and what they've experienced not just from posttraumatic stress but also. Other signature injuries of this combat including traumatic brain injury. So it's been highly probable it over the oh all over the many years it's just now. With two with media attention to actually come to the forefront. And some of the manifestations. How does it up play itself out when Masha Allen returns. Yeah absolutely a nuclear free tickle step back and we look at the job that the properly and so of posttraumatic stress we're looking at approximately two. On 12% of the adult population and that has. Dep present with posttraumatic stress for upwards of 12% below we look at the post 9/11 veterans we're looking at. I'm somewhere between thirty to 213 to 26%. And that's a report from the institute of medicine and on how how the Department of Defense in VA have handled. On post 9/11 veterans. So we're looking at our of much happier or a little bit of higher prevalence of of posttraumatic stress and the current war fighter of the post not eleven generation war fighter. We certainly wanted to. Referee for just a second I wanna make sure I understand something you said it's 12%. That's not in the general population. Big 12% first at a general populous refer to were okay and. And were being found anywhere between thirteen and twenty. 6% in the post 9/11 veterans but there are some pretty good actually suggest that it's it's it could be fifteen times. Higher. In the post 9/11 generation and our PT EST it's it's fifteen times higher than that in the in the current civilian population and so and so again it really depends on on the study EC scene but I think this summary of that is. Is that there in the military population of pulled not eleven veterans. The probable and so of PT EST is which can mean we hire something that that we really have to. I'm be aware. And what again what the what sort of manifestations what's. Do you say PT SD OK fine you have a Shirley I don't know what I Hattie how do you determine this and what are and maybe symptoms isn't the right. Right terminology. I think we you know we would we've all heard stories about. Military people who come back. With alcohol addiction problems and that's nothing new I mean Vietnam was notorious for that. But also. Violence. Suicide. That type of thing oh. How how is this expressing itself when they get back. In there what would be considered a normal life. Yes so Sony get back to start to see symptoms. Symptoms of PT EST within the within. Both from the population LC issues with sleep. You'll see inability of of folks to initiate sleep or to maintain sleep. So they're becoming a little bit more sleep deprived and something and and that could be related to nightmares. On the also see individuals who present who actually hyper vigilant on they are very much aware of all their surroundings and on and any type of noise any type. A recognition of something that could be frightful or something that is related. Two there exposure to trauma while they were in combat beacon signal that it did do that try to do. The armed situation where they respond on very sensitively to that. And that's something in the event that we consider to be hyper vigilance so they're very much the veterans are very much aware and they respond a little differently. And then other folks who who do not have to post traumatic stress. So Heatley sleep issues with the hyper vigilance issues we see. Some individuals who actually become isolated. And then that also lead contribute a little bit more of a presentation similar to depression. So so where you're seeing that sort of cluster of symptoms that really. On. Results and that veteran to become a little bit more isolated. On the normal on their performance perhaps they'll work or on the jobs first a decline in ability to maintain jobs to be a little bit of the social cues that you start to see. Not just the clinical presentation. On the inability. Tom and sometimes that that contributes to beat dependence on alcohol to bend com. The dependence on alcohol or dependent on the other medications source self medication. So you start to see this whole cluster of not only clinical symptoms but social. Our social cues that really. That release signal that this person is suffering from off from posttraumatic. And we're talking with Alex bell over with the wounded warrior project of up post traumatic stress. Disorder among returning veterans. I would ask you do you see more of a prevalence in various branches of the service when it comes to PT SD. Certainly what we've seen in and my experience and come on on active duty. I'm working directly with veterans we've seen now army. I'll Marine Corps. Who goes to those folks who have been actually on the front lines. On the do experience. Post traumatic stress but we we don't feel that there is say a disproportionate. To its. I'm a disproportionate. Amount of two pieces based on and on particular branch of terrorists. But don't who've experienced a significant amount of combat those would be army. Marine Corps. On the we have seen prompt more of those patients in on the clinical side. On but but again pound the exposure to trauma and the exposure exposure to that deployed environment while in either Iraq or Afghanistan. Or other hostile territory it. A week still he folk presenting with pulpit symptoms associated posttraumatic stress. So irrespective of service. So it would butcher save of the percentages are higher with. Ground troops amulets and did to kind of simplify it. If someone's actually. And if they're on a ship in the push a button. And a cruise missile takes off and goes you know a hundred miles away that's a whole lot different experience then. Entering the home and either accidentally or otherwise you know killing someone. And seeing the immediate results of your actions. Certainly that bad that type of combat on the ground global environment however I've actually talked to us several several members who've actually flown drones. On pat drone pilots who actually had to make. Who have actually had to push the trigger. And actually. Dish oil facilities so they didn't know whether or not they were to strike a facility that may affect. Kid in the surrounding neighborhood. So even though they were remote and not actually on the on on the ground there making those decisions two on two possibly. And lives of civilians or our civilian casualties or to protect those lives of of our troops fighting gun range. That still can impart a significant amount of trauma on an individual even though they may be remote from the situation. That ability to you to make those decisions still has consequences. And that may be and the consequences. Are generally occur often. You know you know as a result of perhaps the bodies resilience or perhaps someone party that. No matter relates to bear on them mental state that. And it I guess what the bottom line is in in one aspect is that. War isn't very pleasant visit. Our. I'm on your way you have it you're you're you're the woman has a doctorate in philosophy not me. The head I didn't know that until just but just before we started our conversation. But it in all it was general Sherman war is hell and he was certainly no. Based on some of the actions he took. Is. Because I'm also thinking you know there's the bears have a side of the coin. The people who are on the receiving end of this type of violence to certainly they are being impacted. Tremendously by. The conflagration that they would they not be. That's certainly and you need the armed two civilians as well who who experience two posttraumatic stress of well it's been been noted. Especially with. The Israeli economy in Israel worst civilians who are constantly under. Under a state of threat. I'm what do they do experience or they do endorse symptoms for posttraumatic stress living and in that particular environment does lead to heightened. Not sensitivity or heightened awareness of your environment and they and the potential for four deferred tax that any time so and so there are. You know there are. I would imagine that would be true for anyone who's living in a war zone wouldn't. Yes that absolutely correct in those studies have been done by by a wide variety of individuals and measuring post traumatic stress. And not in civilians who are in it in in two zones where where conflict is common. I guess you know and not to go off on a totally PeopleSoft oracle discussion. We Americans have been very very lucky. Over the over the course of our history. The exception of the revolution in the civil war room we really haven't had. To face. Any sort of war situation. Even though we have engaged in them. There are not in our neighborhoods. And I picked I think sometimes that may rule we don't necessarily take the same perspective on. The activity as others might. The French for example. Who have been you know the center of two world wars. Have sometimes been accused of not being is enthusiastic about war. And perhaps for good reason. And likely again it's it's all the perspectives and you know win win the when we had the events that occurred on the on September. Eleventh we actually experience a very traumatic situation. And they are still individuals civilians as well those who lost loved ones. Who. In in New York in not not just new York New Jersey metropolitan area but throughout the country who still have. On adverse reaction to that level of trauma dole wasn't the a typical war attacked a wartime attacked with tanks and infantry it was an attack on our country in and that actually. Tom has shown that perhaps. You know folks are still suffering from post traumatic stress. Related towed to those events so it's it's a little different than actually beat down. You know what transpired during World War I and World War II. And we're talking with Alex Melbourne with the wounded warrior project here on Carolina focused. Of I guess the question then becomes how does this how do you treat this how do you know how do we ameliorate this problem. That whenever rises. And Canada. That's a great question and an absolutely there are providers out there my my number one recommendation for for any veterans that are worked with or are you an active duty personal and it worked weapon in the past. Is to seek help arm bar one of our main goal here with then we're nowhere project has been to reduce the stigma because help is available on the air or. Aren't there are treatment strategies and modalities that that actually are scare the very. Efficacious in terms of treating it. Posttraumatic stress suffer one example within wounded warrior project and a warrior care network we work with one of the leading experts. Ian now posttraumatic stress treatment or more specifically. On doctor Barbara Roth farm has has has been the one of the pioneers such. In in a form of cognitive behavioral therapy called up prolonged exposure therapy. I'm it is considered to be one of the gold standard for treatment of posttraumatic stress. I'm so that type of treatment and that high level treatment and this is a treatment that goes on over the course of of weeks and even months on. Treatment is available in treatment is available for veterans through the DNA. When the warrior project also has programs a clinical programs that are there to help veterans who may not to achieve to seek help through the VA. Arm but we do know that the that there are. Great treatment strategy Dirk gold standard evidence based treatment strategies available eyes just a question of perhaps. Com a bit the barriers to access to. On our folks not willing to go to the VA for whatever reason because they may not to trust of the day or orbit the Q was too long. I'll put them together and I'm however my. Initial. My initial recommendation is to always seek treatment and organizations like wounded warrior project. And all of our programs with them mental health space aren't there to help support that decision making. And provide the care that these veterans mean. And if someone is experiencing. These symptoms or has a loved one that is. How can get in touch with you. Our bacon deacon get a touch of a store web sites when it warrior project dot org. And they would just follow the prompts. To contact you to get some help for us. That's correct you can look under the combined tiller we have our own dedicated. A web site within the work project dot dot org that directs an individual. To our mental health programs one of those programs it is warrior terror network content which is page. Collaborative collaboration between wounded warrior project ten and four major medical senators from those are mass general hospital and are home based program. Emory university and there are Emory university medical center. And there are am and they are veterans program UCLA medical center and their operation mend program. And Rush University Medical Center in their road home program on all four of those. In collaboration when it warrior project have a specific programs. To work. Two to treat veterans who were experiencing post traumatic. And of course we've all heard about the number of suicides of returning veterans and that sort of thing and you you just have to kind of wonder if this is an all part of the all part of the same scenario that somewhat. That very conservative figure of about twenty desperate day is that it's very troubling much of that is related to mental health and getting proper adequate care about mental health and that's really something that as an organization. When it warrior project. Billy is looking to pound paved the way to remove the stigma. For receiving care. Not all the casualties happen on the battlefield veteran Alex Albert with the wounded warrior project we appreciate you being here on Caroline to. Yes thank you very much for having him greatly appreciated. You are listening to Carolyn focus on who's 1110993. WPT. 1079 in the link. One of 2.5 sixth and the fan and it's also available as a podcast WET dot com. I'm your host mark Thomas recently there's been a big defense field. With the nation of Saudi Arabia signed by the trump administration. And joining us now from financial engines is Andy Smith financial engines as a program you can hear Saturday mornings at ten on WBT. Good morning Andy. Good morning mark how are. Greatly blessed. This deal is hundreds of billions over ten years and I think there's an initial purchase or something like a 110 billion dollars. In defensive armaments and you know planes and bombs and things like that. This has been some good news for some of the defense contractors I'm if I'm not mistaken. It's going to be a decent thing going forward but it is might not be what everybody thinks it's cracked up to be long term I mean if you look at. Kind of what's happened in the industry since trump want in November. And then kind of take those numbers and look historically. About what we've seen over time. You'd see a little bit of a bomb but it's not necessarily this cataclysmic change. That you know everybody maybe wants it to to be here everybody thinks it's be especially these defense. Industry investors mean. The industry's been pot almost doubled. The total return of the broad S&P 500 over that time frame. And but I think the troops in the putting just like anything else there's not a whole lot of sizzle. In these sorts of deals if you take of people out of it if he takes this sector out of it. Mean it is I mean it's classic PR it's classic kind of media marketing. The details are going to be worked out here over time what everybody's focusing on is just kind of the overall pro possible number. But what you did in in terms of looking at those those initial numbers trying to get a sense of what it means here in the short term that's really where people need to be looking and I think that is you dig into the deal. People get a little bit surprised in terms of what numbers. Occur when. What actions occur when and then how much actually have to happen overtime resting at this this apple kind of multi billion dollar number. As far as you mentioned the returns I'll be honest really I'm not a financial guy. It's out of my Bailiwick I don't know how much you can talk about specific companies and stocks and that sort of thing. There's basically two top contributors to the performance. Industry like it that. Pretty hot since the election. You look at you look at Huntington angles it's about 32 and a half percent since since the election general dynamics at about 3132%. Six since the election. So that the industry overall op yeah but you've got these two huge players. That are contributing a lot to this performance as a factor you need to be very wary. About what you're buying buying individual stocks get it do a lot of research into and stay on top of that on a regular basis. But if you're just kind of Mexico into the the defense or the aerospace and defense sector. Like with any key apps you need to be very mindful of all the different companies that are making up those returns. Yeah because I know a lot of people probably heard of general dynamics. You know we your Boeing and Lockheed Martin's people like that right which you mentioned Huntington what what do they do. Huntington deal a lot with the needy contracts. In terms. Boats. Telemetry a lot of Canada that the mechanics nuts and bolts. Aspects of object deployment for that. Accurately that they mean when people see these news stories you know trump signed on and ten billion dollar weapons deal. Doses well it could mean for you know American chops theoretically this is what it would mean for different industries are different. Companies within the industry. Most people are. Wired to be able to do individual company individual stock research facility do is they throw money into an ET app and exchange traded time. It deals with that sector overall. So we'll we're seeing right now on our side is that people are kind of sector shopping again. Right so acts they are there as the ETF that exchange traded fund that covers aerospace and defense stocks it's on net inflows. Like 200 million dollars in November alone so another 68 million dollars in inflows in December so half. And with that one media that basically doubled its assets. Between October and December of last year that is really hard. Sometimes for a manager to take that much money and deploy that in his or her field. Effectively. So what we see a lot as we were going through these statements of client for gallantry statements of people come in and they have all these different sectors actually are. We're seeing a lot more of we ask them what senate they got no clue they just see Disney's storied early and dentist office three no magazine. And they say hey defense the pot again you should throw money into it. You do that and if you don't follow up with the research there's a good line it is a good chance that you can get burned because your holding things for the wrong reasons and you don't know when to change. Wendy industry changes around. And we're talking with a Andy Smith with financial engines which is heard Saturday mornings at ten on WBT. You talked about the long term. Return of the five folder something like that over and I was at like since September 11 because and one of the grass and I did little bit of research I didn't understand much of dirt. But it looked like the graphs showed that people like Lockheed and Boeing. And general dynamics you know we were far outpacing the general stock market as far as returns. And increases in stock prices over in the past 1516 years. Is that something that you see actually continuing. In the overall broader sense. Well there's a couple of things so when you take. And when you take individual. Companies and then compare against there their underlying index. You're gonna be. You're gonna see some pretty big discrepancies. Because you're dealing with one company. Purses. However money companies make up you know that particular index general dynamics against the S&P 500 for example well you look over a one year time. You know general dynamics is up around 40% yes and peace that you know maybe 15%. There's a lot of individual volatility that comes wit. Investing in that one particular stock. In terms of what we would expect to Siegel and forward I think that that would be the case for any individual stock verses. An underlying index individual stocks and very specific business risks. Sometimes currency risk if you're dealing with companies outside the United States you have management risk if product risk when you spread that. Those different pieces of volatility over a number of different issues like you have it. The S&P 500 announced that NASDAQ down Jones to some extent. Mitigating that volatility you're mitigating that risk. So when. When people call this show and they say. You know animal we're talking about now look transplant that steal huge deal it can mean a lot for the sector how much should I do Porsche they do it at all. I try to get a sense of what they're trying to accomplish. Within their particular portfolio. If they just they're looking at that performance of an individual stock. And trying to match that performance against their entire portfolio you're never gonna see. Because with few taking on more risky see the potential for more return but that's not what you wanna do with your long term assets you wanna do it may be small or. But your overall count. When people half to put to words why they want to invest in defense stocks why they want to invest some time in the individual equities. They don't have a good reasons for. So what kind of comes down to is you need to have a reason and you need to diversify. Our. So it's not it's not a while I saw that going to be a well they signed the deal so I'm gonna go by whoever is but building fighter jets this week that's sort of. Yep because these you know political fortunes. After fortunes can be made in Austin thirty days your job is to focus on the next thirty years. And figure out how to get all the way to and through retire so you look at this deal. You pull back and look at Trump's proposed budget his budget actually shows only a temporary increase. In defense spending before projected decline as this year US GDP so it would actually put defense spending lasts. Than is currently projected by the CBO. So if you're reading that magazine article BC sent an on this on and on TV. And you say oh my gosh I gotta get into the sector and lets you do some digging that can absolutely blow up in your face and then all of a sudden you got this huge gaping hole in your portfolio. That you just absolutely cannot. Use or need. At this point in years in your savings. Career any Smith with that perhaps apt metaphor. In brief what what's your final thoughts on investing in this particular market. I was safe figure out why Europe why you want to invest in this particular sector if that makes sense in your overall portfolio and you have a plan to use that. And a plan to get out great. But don't try to time the market were trying in any sector investing that there's no one magic bullet investment the only thing that that works. Is he saving as much as you can for as long as you can't inside that diversified portfolio assert your listening. And it sounds like you and you took advantage assembly sector back and you really don't know what you're doing the work he has set some concerns about which your advisors trying to get Q in. And somebody else look at it. We beat we'd be happy to do that I get the financial engines dot com you can top that Austin and Sean there in town great guys they understand that. But you have to make sure that you diversified. You have to make sure that your only taking on the least not a risk necessary beat pitcher goals. But most importantly don't worry about the sector bets you just say as much as he can for as long as you can't you're gonna be okay. Andy Smith with financial engines heard here Saturday mornings at ten on WBP we appreciate to be in on Carolina focus mark thank you. I'm your host mark Thomas. Thanks for listening to Carolina focus. Okay. Okay. Yeah it. I. Okay. I. You're listening to Carolina focus on who's eleventh and 993 WBT. 1079 the link. One or 2.5 610 the fan and it's also available to podcast the WBT dot com. I'm mark Thomas your hosts were coming up on the fiftieth anniversary. The six day war in the Middle East. A lot of people are aware of the fact that there were American casualties in the six day war and joining us now is Ray McGovern who was. Point 7 years with a Central Intelligence Agency. And now also in military intelligence. Welcome the Carolina focus mr. McGovern. Thank you mark. Not yet it's this is one of these things. Two north Carolinians. Melvin Douglas Smith and lieutenant James pierce. Died in the six day war. And I think a lot of people would be surprised to hear is that Americans to die in that conflict. In and in brief how did how did happen. We'll be remembers as a crew the USS liberty. This Tuesday intelligence collection ship. And by the military and by NSA. And are located. About thirteen nautical miles outside of the and I say American Consulate. During that the sixty war. It was a very sensitive time. And the court certainly the secret grotto at this intelligent trick is still being. Since it was a remained so that antennae. And it and had warned that lame the gun on the front at that couldn't defend itself clearly it would and so collection at. What exactly transpired. I first became aware of the USS liberty and 37. Crewman were lost. It almost struck me as being kind of like an inverted Gulf of Tonkin situation in that the Gulf of Tonkin situation was we've all heard of that but in reality there wasn't much that actually happened. Yet here's something that actually did happen. And we don't hear very much about it. You know Mark Arum you know way it is it politicized thing and when you say the severity from the loss well in a normal. Until. Then you know when people talk these days about the problem. They were on the pushed them kill so. And then they use of more direct language here and there. You know who warn people live there full disclosure. I've been pleased with this issue for as long as there in the learning at that. And that's got fifteen years. I am an investigative reporter now having retired from my CIA analyst position. And I feel that strongly about these thirty core. Problem. Not all of that killed this is story. In the midst of the state war. On June 8. Fifty years ago a 1967. The USS liberty is a beautiful day was converted. About an hour in the morning by you know by Israeli because since aircraft. And they wave that needed to have any church negating the sentinel. And beautifully and I and Angelina evil. Yes and he's in Mediterranean they were careful est. Well into the international waters because it was a war going. The Arabs and Israelis who arranged and go to the Israelis certainly succeeded in destroying pretty much. The Syrian armed forces is depleted Air Force's matters in. And the same beat trip shouldn't it would should Iranian position toward the end. All that destruction and and neither has been pretty good offshore and after the preakness circle this. Unmarked. Planes came came back and and certain. Little lane needs. You know if the liberty. China well intended that they do. Or operational. And started. The great thing and then shooting a short. After about an hour three Israeli cook you don't go to create. And the ability that he. Cut their computers only one hit credit and they ship. Until though the Marines and others who work in I think listening devices that they had there. And below Campbell and quell. So the question this. Lawyer didn't. That is exactly why why why would they do this. It doesn't make any sense. Well. You know it doesn't have. I guess you know as an intelligent here and it has to tell you straight out. That it didn't deliberately. I don't know that. Intercepted communications. Plan is to control our. That's the American ship the republic Italy and it's like the big red as big American flag there. Well you're it is folly but but but an American can probably orders. There were many many messages like that. And so the ship was a very very good shape but it does appear that it. And what happened whether it's women. They have to cut Pakistan. With the seriously wounded to get them on lifeboat. The torpedo boats came back in the street and put a hole and he has my opinion as a war crime pure and simple. There are helicopters would Israeli. Commandos Benito who lived the surface of the initiative. And a young. Meet the little Taylor from Texas case. I mean that Terry are blatantly. He does that. And kept in the comical and that kept. I think tech and they get connected that'll. It'll. Antenna that they didn't and a cause it was a work in. Exactly you know of course Derek get that thing all put that we get actually. And the article is but he didn't look at that debt or they I think it would have gate across the deck you can call that good. And obligations that are request permission. Commission granted. How did he go to. Plugs in this cable entity. He called. Antenna. And get an SOS. Thank dad that the Israelis intercepted the SOS and they. Real quick they broke up the attack. He attacked is clearly meant. According to Israeli just that the best interest to think that ship but absolutely. No surprise as. But they broke up the attack now if so this went to two. US aircraft areas in the media in the region the USS Saratoga youth of America immediately. The admiral and urgent attention of course dispatched quite Obama's to do battle. Which would let her know whoever was impacting on dealerships in the US liberty. Carefully there. They'll call back. It will guy who hit pushed commander. We demonstrated. The secretary of manic MacNamara. Faces certain you know somebody's stretching my ship and that and it had to talk tear superior officer. It is not funny but that was the president the president there he got a maligned exit. I don't want it caused no trouble with ally Israel you'd call those clean backing you call that lead back now. Now of course you're talking about Lyndon Johnson. In this particular case. And so. So the place to call back now. What was to be felt that. Well we token that is that they had at some other boats to try to get some relief to the USS liberty it. It limped back to Alter. Where. The the remains of the 34 that the greed and gritty. Floated out the whole Peterman. And made. We're. Put together his best to Taylor could. The one that's survived who take into Greece. Now they're closed decrease and that the next morning. Because of them was approached by it and able authorship who had and that's pretty much court. You're not to mention anything about this attack especially who perpetrated to anyone including a life. And you look at that depict pregnant court partial to mention it to one another here that understand that. But the crew the survivors and no yeah I talked about thirty court kill. A 170. Plus or wounded. The crew. Members there two hundred eighties they get that to record and then it shipped either wounded or killed. What happens well. And he is tailored. Who had a fear of court martial kept it Moshe. What happens John McCain's other admiral McCain. The launch date very quickly investigation. And found. But nothing happened English the bad mistake but he's real trade. So the a couple of cover up participated in. Only by Lyndon Japan and landed in the bud the administration. But by congress. And by powerfully. In you know if it may be itself. Nine president. Nine presidents from the Lyndon Johnson. Through Barack Obama. Refused to leave this refuse to acknowledge it and participated in this. Connector cover. The only person showed any good. What admiral Thomas Moore. Who had been cheapened needle operation and imminent injury she's there. He knew darn well and had there. Launched its own investigation. He came up with the this is the result they can mention of the leopard attack. Beatty to to leave the survivors and unconscionable. And covered up by the US government. Military naval operators in. Radio operator. In. Marco. And he's listening to these conversations between Washington and the commander of the telling couldn't get that little guy. And that he he quote. McNamara. As saying the president has been. Doesn't want endangered patients who it's true. Just because it looked a couple of soldiers so cute couple tailored. So it's so that the data is limited in and they have every good and much covered this thing out the matter that. Here is that the agreed to a different dignity. Descended. I have no good at the captain of the comical it is made at all. But he kept at triple quote it is seriously look at and so it spectacle of they weren't able they were not able to repair it they they junket. Byrd family is later. Great that they felt that they edited. Leadbetter by the kind of coincided with certainty yet in the metal cutter. Now. When they approached that of the White House. Quite afford the State Department that. This anti Israeli money it would leave the chronicle. Don't want. And so the big problem quickly trillion debt and it. Was confined accretive. Kept McConnell called cook and blue. Well he did a way that they do it. You know most Americans who remembers it medal of honor. I give them a way to full that the time. Had this kind of middle it was given to kept in the chronicle. On this million banks of the pollutants and cut fear river. Let the navy still has so little so I'll. So they're going to keep their original crew grew quiet. And didn't mention is that. Terry I appreciate what happened to him. Well he lived in this central valley California if he left Texas. And that didn't need congressional district of code named. Jonas. That didn't know that. Whom some of the year your leader enter your cool although it the head of the House Intelligence Committee in Washington. I heard about what happened to liberty and to have a listing credit. He convened the meeting in his office. After persuading the Defense Department. To award carry out great GA. The that's what he has total car. Now. That the next. And medal of honor. And Alba gave it was in his district and thought that this should be to speak with they did so. And so when I heard of that right out there that this valley California could play that could inundate Kovalev night at this for the celebration. And it was incredibly incredibly moving. More global. Because then that. Several of the other liberty of either. You know argument cut that PP me. It the national day of Monaco a picker upper body court. Comma comma equipment vehicles. Because Cokie you like it could come here. Well what could he kissed the what could these quote that eloquent than long conversations. And they haven't been acknowledge them could you update. Only Atmel on the smaller group that could investigation. When militants. This conclusion the court. And so here in the fiftieth anniversary. Of this terrible. You know he was coming true. Charissa I'm. Does he told people that you know sub the government definitely has the and covered it up. People get hurt and people who could be awarded the people who could be other part that kinda grew increasingly. Communicating. And that's the story of core of the Buick Mercury. And we're talking to Ray McGovern. Who was point 7 years with the Central Intelligence Agency. About the USS liberty and the 34 service members that were killed. During the six day war you mentioned used the phrase a day of infamy. Songs are local listeners will or be familiar with another. A day of infamy which I guess you can see the original day of infamy and Pearl Harbor. There's a via another radio station owner in the market. News grandfather was admiral husband Kimmel. And his cameras and trying to get to get his name cleared for decades and meeting much the same resistance. That. The liberty is getting. So this is you know. I'm beginning to see a pattern. Yeah. So Ray McGovern we appreciate you being here in Carolina focus and keep up the good work in your quarters or journalist. And have a blessed week. I think simply scrape of this Liberty's survivors that made him. I'm your host mark Thomas in 2001. I was the weekend morning hosted them. And that memorial in 2000 and put together the peace. What shipments again. Memorial today. Conjures up images of gray haired old men waving tiny flags while color guards pass by and a their tears tutor kids softly down weathered and cheeks. A Memorial Day really isn't about fuel. About the young sometimes. Very yeah. They're on the Kathryn Lopez arranger kings mountain national military park. They played different. Matter and repeated the women out. One teacher even Perry and then they let him know where are the homeland. They also guarded packing animals some even active despise and also held positions of leadership during the revolution. I'm new England's been handling that major Thomas young. Chronicle is not write me on the boil and then he hit on the screen among the young and could have been doing island I didn't have to battle. If they cannot with each other when they realized. Clinton is down his arm and you know where you young man in the mold of iron in my opinion. That's pretty heady stuff for someone who was sixteen at the battle of kings mountain. Colonel James Williams was also with the battle kings mountain with the suns Daniels and Joseph. They saw their father died on the slopes of kings mountain. They continued to fight for liberty in the southern campaign for more than a year until they ran into Bill Cunningham in South Carolina. Bloody bill was what he was tall and for good reason. On November 19 21781. Bloody Bill Cunningham had both captain Daniel Williams seventeen. And younger brother Joseph. Fourteen executed for their fight for freedom. Today we hear constant refrain the children are growing up too fast and measures are introduced to a regular basis to protect our young people. From youth violence and take steps to keep those under eighteen away from firearm. This memorial perhaps we should kick cause of the events honoring those who have fallen in defense of America. And not the face of the old. But of the young and ask are we shortchanging ourselves and argue like concentrating on what teenagers head. Instead of realizing there is much they can after all teenagers helped found our nation and song we memorialize this weekend. I'm mark Thomas news talk 1110 WB team. And that was sixteen years ago and a little over three months prior to September 11. Since that time an entire generation has grown up with the Bettina of war covering their lives. American troops have died in Afghanistan. Iraq. Yemen Somalia. Pakistan Libya cutter. The Philippines. Kenya Ethiopia the sea shells. Crews extend. And Jordan. As general Schuettler said in 2006. We're gonna generational war. As we commemorate those American troops who have died in war it may seem cold and countless to ask hard questions about our country's future. And whether or not war should be a permanent fixture in our lives. Perhaps we perpetuate war by glorifying it sacrifices. In 1795. Teams Matheson wrote of all the enemies to public liberty war is perhaps. The most to be dreaded because it comprises and develops the germ of every other. Walrus the pair of army's. From these proceed debts and taxes. And armies and debts and taxes are the known instruments. For bringing the many under the domination of the few. In war to the discretionary power of the executives extended. Its influence in dealing out offices honors and a monuments is multiplied. And all the means of seducing the mines. Added to those of subduing the force the people. The same malignant aspect of republicanism may be traced in the inequality of fortunes and the opportunities of fraud. Growing out of the state of war. And in the did generously of manners and morals engendered by both. No nation can preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare. Again according James Madison as a nation that is seemingly mirror and eating in a warrior he throws how were we to avoid Madison's warning. Indeed it is disturbing to reflect on such things at such a somber time but. It's in introspection we must path we are not to become a perpetual victim of humanity's.